> Where did you hear this? The Goldstars have already been canceled for this quarter.Next, I believe this post will most likely be useful for those who entered MS as intern/college hires. 1. My first year I thought for sure I would sit at L61 for another year, but to my surprise I was promoted to L62 without even a full FY under my belt. I'm currently level 66 and started at level 59 (equivalent in old levels) 12 years ago. You have the right stuff to succeed and Microsoft is very happy with you. Then follow Mini's advice and you should be all set. HC-freeze is already in motion, as is serioius savings in all FSC/COS - only thing still not explored is layoffs. She partners very closely with colleagues to develop and drive the people strategy across the UK GEO. L63 takes a bit longer but is also fast. It takes a little time to get on your skip-level manager's radar. "Next, I believe this post will most likely be useful for those who entered MS as intern/college hires. Take responsibility for defining the component in front of you -- is it really the right thing for the product/team? >> You forgot "never ask for a promotion".This is better written as "Ask what specific things you are lacking in, which are preventing you from being promoted to the next level". Entry level (4,718) Associate (1,976) Mid-Senior level (40,085) Normally this is acceptable but right now i smell lawsuit. Or at least, more transparent feedback was communicated so you had a real idea of where your career was heading. .css-1odorsr{display:-webkit-inline-box;display:-webkit-inline-flex;display:-ms-inline-flexbox;display:inline-flex;-webkit-align-items:center;-webkit-box-align:center;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;font-weight:700;}.css-1ln5qhx{-webkit-text-decoration:none;text-decoration:none;display:-webkit-inline-box;display:-webkit-inline-flex;display:-ms-inline-flexbox;display:inline-flex;-webkit-align-items:center;-webkit-box-align:center;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;font-weight:700;}.css-1dmvvgc{margin:0;color:#0060b9;-webkit-text-decoration:none;text-decoration:none;display:-webkit-inline-box;display:-webkit-inline-flex;display:-ms-inline-flexbox;display:inline-flex;-webkit-align-items:center;-webkit-box-align:center;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;font-weight:700;}Get your salary negotiated .css-1npej63{-webkit-user-select:none;-moz-user-select:none;-ms-user-select:none;user-select:none;width:1em;height:1em;display:inline-block;fill:currentColor;-webkit-flex-shrink:0;-ms-flex-negative:0;flex-shrink:0;-webkit-transition:fill 200ms cubic-bezier(0.4, 0, 0.2, 1) 0ms;transition:fill 200ms cubic-bezier(0.4, 0, 0.2, 1) 0ms;font-size:1.25rem;margin-left:-4px;}or your resume reviewed by the real experts - recruiters who do it daily. I don't yet have any insight into what it might take to become a Partner, so I won't comment on that. Any tips will be greatly helpful. Stop fighting which is where mapped. . Will a team that needs exactly the skills and interests that you have pass on you because of some HR guideline? As a L64 I find getting to 65 quite a wall. Pass me by and I will be leaving in the next few months). If you're off-path, you can turn it around. Microsoft, Go to company page They are trying to get attention from upper levels more harder then you. The general consensus is why get rid of someone who is happy doing their job and can do it better than anyone else. :). The average entry-level engineer or program manager will have a total compensation of $125,665. This means there are 24 distinct job levels at Microsoft. Some are good at all. But if your manager is undervaluing your work, and *that* is the factor that is making you unhappy, you can fix that. This is hard for your manager -- he probably doesn't have a clear idea of what it will take to make the case. Thank goodness for this blog, where MS employees are free to talk about their personal struggles, unlike "other" blogs that censor/prohibit such discussions, so that they can live in some fantasy land and avoid dealing with the real issues. But that will only be one more indicator that you are not ready to "face" your obstacles. I have actively helped people leave MS who were topped out at level at MS but who wanted to do something else. That's not going to change in six months (which I learned). It makes a difference in your relationship. jcr said >Apple's about to ship Snow Leopard with no new features. Isn't morale over the holidays going to be just wonderful? Pop quiz: who is it? Seems like "director" in Microsoft is not really a level like it is in google or fb (not sure what it means). How about a thread on the current hiring/moving freeze, or on surviving the New Ice Age? I've seen some extremely senior developers propose solutions to problems, but be totally unconvincing. The Job titles for this position are: Software Development Engineer SDE Success breeds Success: I remember reading an article about an extensive study to determine the best predictor of a stocks price tomorrow. the answer is simple - take on more. Don't be afraid to ask your manager some very direct questions.Don't force the issue. They don't care who gets the credit, and they fight for good reviews for their people. Aspects of an L63 Contributor: some random aspects that come to my mind beyond our CSPs: When I write all of this, I think back to an older piece by Joel Spolsky talking about Rosh Gadol contributors. You will make your management look good and the levels will come. I think talking about level just confuses people as beyond US there is a different level system!L63 in the US is Senior (Level 60 in most of the other countries), well, moving to Senior is not such a big thing if you have experience, with more than 10 years in the industry I was hired at this level, now Senior II is just a matter of continuing contributing but the different comes to Principal (or lead), here is where you need to shine in order to succeed.Recommendation: Work not only towards your commitments but your managers as well As a former L65 (left MSFT about two months ago) I can say you are right on when it comes to understanding where your boss stands. Thanks for keeping this focused. We need to grow out of this bad legacy syndrome that we still have. But good leadership at the top can make visibility a positive thing for the person getting it and for the org who sees the person getting it. I would love to be above 60much less 63. Incompetent people tend to significantly overstate their performance, and significantly understate that of their co-workers. Apple should in no way be throwing stones at Microsoft in this regard. Absolutely not Definitely yes 3 1 David Lean Worked at Microsoft (company) (1990-2009) Upvoted by Jack Schofield , Computer journalist who has covered Microsoft for 35 years. In MCS, soft skills are often more important than hard skills since you work with customers (often angry ones), sales (often under pressure and looking for someone to blame). you want to complete A and A requires 10 devs. But power plays are at work and I get smacked when I try and take on extra work.So my question to the more experienced is this - how does one get the attention of management when they are focused on their own problems, their favorite underlings (of which I am not one), and when there is not enough work to go around? Managers plan out promotion timeframes far in advance. You might have the Microsoft Senior Career Stage Profile in front of you all marked up and broken into more sections in OneNote, but which ones matter most to your team? The conclusion: its price today! Executing on what you have now at a high rate/quality level.2. Buy a Principal a coffee. Could somebody please confirm or deny this. That figures. Senior-level Marketing Executive with experience in the consumer and B2B industry. I also don't know if this is the first step towards a lay-off, but for now, it seems we'll have jobs for a few more months.Ugh, not good, not good at all. Really inspiring. Now read over your answer. Up to that point the "what" you accomplish can get you pretty far and you get some wiggly room on the how. And you know something? If they see flaws you have flaws. And your manager will not hate you for thinking about switching -- if you are a great employee to begin with, he will just want to keep you around. I think that a lot of what you wrote was spot on, although the situation varies somewhat across the company. This makes it very easy to feel underleveled, because the 6 people that started 3 weeks before you might take up the 2 promotion spots available per year for 3 years (numbers all made up).You also, at least in my experience, aren't really given feedback on when you're performing at a level that *could* be promoted. Will a L63 have direct reports and/or manage v-? Salesmanship is extremely important. weeks to find another position within the company, otherwise they are laid off.Given 6 weeks to find a position now is a suicide (since most groups can't hire due to the freeze). L68 is partner, or you may see GM. So he is looking to become partner this year on the team's work. I would lay some level of accountability with management as well, though. Do a brownbag for your VP level group, record it and send out the link to everyone. But above L62 the talent is intense and that is good. Most of our ways of doing things have so many imperfections that you would not have any trouble to find obvious thing to improve in obvious ways. Joined MCS at level 60 and was immediately told that L61 would be years away. Ultimately, I decided to leave the company. Like many technology companies, Microsoft uses levels to indicate seniority for employees, including engineers. I might be still employed by Microsoft if I knew he wasnt doing it willingly.One thing I would do different if I could do it again is to not advance levels any faster than I have to. Do not accept promises, or you will be already disappointed with your new team as soon as some promises dont materialize (and believe me: you will lose your patience long before some promises materialize). SAP, Go to company page However, the results show that the vast majority of dev/test/pm will make level 63 and in a reasonable timeframe. right? Additionally, a Level 62 doesn't really have the tools to evaluate and sell a promotion to a 63. weeks to find another position within the company, otherwise they are laid off.Think that's known as a "RIF" not a "layoff" butwhat do I know? Do a search for people in those groups in NYC area and check their status to see who is hiring. You forgot "never ask for a promotion".Forgive my cluelessness, but: Why not?MSS. Hi,Now that the Annual review is approaching, I wanted to seek tips on justification putforth to the manager to move from L60-L61. I just want to grow, and I am aware that it does not translate to a promotion always. It doesn't matter what you want - you aren't the one deciding when you get promoted. For example, see http://www.intropsych.com/ch07_cognition/learning_curve.html.